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Author Topic: Sleep and Stun  (Read 2512 times)

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Offline Prescience

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Sleep and Stun
« on: October 05, 2010, 06:09:54 am »
Sleep and stun are unbalanced in their current form. Players are able to time slep/stun casts such that they are able to keep their targets permanently stunned or slept for the duration of a battle.

This is unfair and broken -- Slep/Stun turns players into practice dummies.

Here are 2 suggestions that would improve a broken system:

1. Sleep/Stun should heal the target to 100% on a succesful cast. This gives the caster 1 free round and if the mage/bard casts it again it will reset the fight (target is back at 100%). This is very similar to how polymorph works in World of Warcraft and that spell seems balanced (more or less).

2. Both spells should have diminishing returns.

100% effectiveness vs MR first cast
50% effectiveness vs MR 2nd cast
25% effectiveness vs MR 3rd cast
0% after the 3rd cast

the diminishing returns above should last 1-2 minutes.

Please reply to this post and let us know if something is planned to be done about these broken spells?
« Last Edit: October 05, 2010, 06:30:40 am by Prescience »

Offline kalus

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Re: Sleep and Stun
« Reply #1 on: October 05, 2010, 04:31:19 pm »
Cool down timers. You cast sleep, you can't cast it again until the specified cool down period expires. 6 rounds, 10 rounds, 20 rounds, whatever.

I like cool downs because you can have mega powerful spells (like sleep, or a mega god heal that heals for 600) that can't be cast every round.

Offline Prescience

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Re: Sleep and Stun
« Reply #2 on: October 07, 2010, 12:03:55 pm »
I'm going to keep this topic 'bumped' because I think it is important and should be addressed sooner rather than later. I understand that reducing stun/slep duration from 4 rounds to 1 round was an improvement but it did not alleviate stun-locks...please review.


Offline Stickyhaze

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Re: Sleep and Stun
« Reply #3 on: October 18, 2010, 11:54:46 pm »
If you want sleep to heal, like WoW's polymorph, there are a few things you aren't considering. What would be the purpose of a spell that incapacitates your opponent for one round while healing them to full? And you are talking diminishing returns?
If sleep heals, it would be over time, and sleep would last 4 rounds or more, depending on lvl and MR. I could see diminishing returns then. Polymorph is a crowd control spell. If a mage is going to heal an enemy, that sucka better stay put for 6 rounds while I deal with his friend.


Offline Dragon

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Re: Sleep and Stun
« Reply #4 on: October 19, 2010, 04:08:53 am »
u make stun 1.5 round very difficult cast u difficult resist one

Offline Jigga

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Re: Sleep and Stun
« Reply #5 on: October 19, 2010, 07:46:25 pm »
Having it heal would just be abuse, then bards and mages would be able to heal their friends to 100% with the penalty of losing a round or two... so if you're fighting, you get get away for a round or so and someone stuns you to max hps, it wears off and u go back to the fight, that's nuts
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Offline The Crazy Animal

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Re: Sleep and Stun
« Reply #6 on: December 18, 2010, 12:10:48 am »
I like the idea of cool down timers but not the heal function.

Offline Thergin

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Re: Sleep and Stun
« Reply #7 on: March 08, 2015, 02:26:07 am »
This need addressing, I like the idea of having the spell not as easy to cast or stick on players.

Offline Jumpin Jack Flash

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Re: Sleep and Stun
« Reply #8 on: March 09, 2015, 04:32:04 am »
If you feel sleep and stun are so overpowered, then play a mage or bard.  Otherwise, leave slep and stun the way they are.  A level 50 mage -vs- level 50 paladin has no chance of success without slep.  Of course, this is just taking into account a toe-to-toe battle.  Every class can overpower another class when played by the right person. 

I've had numerous characters resist my slep on first cast.  If you're having an issue with surviving a battle against a mage, then raise your MR, and don't reduce the mage's effectiveness.

Offline Mersinary

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Re: Sleep and Stun
« Reply #9 on: March 09, 2015, 07:24:46 am »
If you feel sleep and stun are so overpowered, then play a mage or bard.  Otherwise, leave slep and stun the way they are.  A level 50 mage -vs- level 50 paladin has no chance of success without slep.  Of course, this is just taking into account a toe-to-toe battle.  Every class can overpower another class when played by the right person. 

I've had numerous characters resist my slep on first cast.  If you're having an issue with surviving a battle against a mage, then raise your MR, and don't reduce the mage's effectiveness.

MagRes needs a rework.  Its complete crap how it works now. 

Offline Coarse Horse

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Re: Sleep and Stun
« Reply #10 on: March 09, 2015, 07:43:38 am »
The biggest problem with slep is that it makes all the other mage debuffs useless.

Deathcow had mentioned the spell Alertness negating sleep as part of the patch he was working on for pre reset. I still urge Vitoc to try and get ahold of him to see what's become of this patch.

This patch balances out the imperfections in base spell mod and adds some new armor and spells. Most of the details were laid out in a forum thread that DC made. Without this patch, this next push will just be a concentrated version of the push that is now ending, complete with all the imbalances we all choked down this time.

Priest/Mage Ahoy.

Offline Crabster

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Re: Sleep and Stun
« Reply #11 on: March 09, 2015, 11:28:46 am »
some will play bard because they have the stun option and dont wanna be on da cookie cutting gravy train....yeah i feel lots of ppl are gonna cookie cutter it up with priest and mage....the ppl that dont cookie cutter it up are the ppl that either just played one and refuse to play same thing cuz of the same thing mentality or ppl that just refuse to be apart of da cookie cutter program....either or, if u dont pick a mage or a priest ur more than likely not gonna win too many pvp battles.....if woke/kb pick priest or mage ill prolly throw up

Offline Mersinary

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Re: Sleep and Stun
« Reply #12 on: March 09, 2015, 01:48:48 pm »
some will play bard because they have the stun option and dont wanna be on da cookie cutting gravy train....yeah i feel lots of ppl are gonna cookie cutter it up with priest and mage....the ppl that dont cookie cutter it up are the ppl that either just played one and refuse to play same thing cuz of the same thing mentality or ppl that just refuse to be apart of da cookie cutter program....either or, if u dont pick a mage or a priest ur more than likely not gonna win too many pvp battles.....if woke/kb pick priest or mage ill prolly throw up

I heard gaunt mystic is where its at.

But slep/stun are stupid powerful in its current form.  The only time I ever see it failed is when slep/stun is already casted on you, I do like how you can recast spells onto somebody if that spell is already on them.  It never gets resisted, or very rarely gets resisted even with 150 magres.  How about some new items or lets say, make it so 5th quest makes you immune to slep/stun?  Kinda like how sunstone makes you immune to single target confusion.
« Last Edit: March 09, 2015, 01:53:00 pm by Mersinary »

Offline Zetetic

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Re: Sleep and Stun
« Reply #13 on: March 10, 2015, 03:19:35 am »
I still urge Vitoc to try and get ahold of him to see what's become of this patch.

This patch balances out the imperfections in base spell mod and adds some new armor and spells. Most of the details were laid out in a forum thread that DC made. Without this patch, this next push will just be a concentrated version of the push that is now ending, complete with all the imbalances we all choked down this time.

I completely agree with this. The current set of bugs/power balance has been well tested. If we start a new push with changes made, there are new things to test and play around with. Interesting bugs to find and systems to find exploits in.

I'd also like to see sleep reduced down to a single combat round (3 seconds). I still feel it would be over-powered, but the timing would become so important that it would no longer be a spell for any occasion. It would at least be easy to do just for testing purposes.